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View Full Version : Painting, do people still care?



ChrisSpaceWolves
04-09-2009, 04:18 AM
I took my newly painted Necrons to the shop tonight. I'm not sure how to react to this.....


Staff member says sarcastically, "Wow, those look painted....No one paints anymore. Where are your Wolves?"

How do you react to that? The other opponent was mashing models with templates, and knocked my lord off of a ridge and said, "oops." It took the wind out of my sails. I'm kinda depressed by it now. In addition to that I played the guard, he threw large Str8 grenades at me with 3 squads. had 6 lascannons 2 punishers and LOTS of troops..... game ended in 6 and he contested my objective and controled the other so I lost.

The initial comments really put a mood on the game for me. wow... just wow.....

Honsou
04-09-2009, 04:19 AM
The other opponent was mashing models with templates, and knocked my lord off of a ridge and said, "oops."
Now if that were at my place, that guy would have been kicked out xD Any damage?

Consadine
04-09-2009, 04:35 AM
How do you react to that? The other opponent was mashing models with templates, and knocked my lord off of a ridge and said, "oops."

I'd like to know how to get the kid who is always touching other kids stuff to stop doing so without being a jerk. Hopefully no damage to the Lord.

No one paints anymore? I thought you played at an official GW store or Bunker. Those have the 3 color rule (along with a completed base or painted green!), right? GW Grey just doesn't fly in those fine institutions :p

I know a lot of people at my store don't paint their models, and when they do, they're not well done at all. Granted, mostly kids (12-16) are there and they aren't the best, but the number of unpainted models, or primed models, is sickening. A unit here or there is fine because sometimes you don't have time to finish a unit or whatnot, but for weeks on end? Eh...

He might have meant that no one paints well anymore. Get everything done with 3 colors and based, then go play.

Although, as you have shown, it doesn't take that long to get good results. You should hold workshops! :p

And for those games that got you down... more Monoliths :p

LAZtheinfamous
04-09-2009, 04:38 AM
Well, accidents happen. While the knocking the Lord off the ridge is not a treasonable crime, it does deserve more then a simple "oops." An apology is in order at the very least.

However, the staff members comments are out of order. At the very least, the staffer should be applauding your painting, if to sell more paint if nothing else. The extras of the hobby are saleable items as well.

People not painting is always a problem, always has been a problem, always will be a problem. Disrespecting those that do, is a much worse crime though. I would probably try to find another game store. The lack of painted models is a small problem, barely worth mentioning, but the lack of respect is a very large problem.

Was this an official GW store or an Indy? I've never had this type of problem in an indie.

Inquisitor Alex
04-09-2009, 05:02 AM
I hate playing against unpainted armies. New squad ? no time to paint it ? fine. Whole army ? C'mon... As for the knocking stuff over, if the other guy is genuinely clumsy, he'll break something of his :) I was playing this guy at a GW years ago and he knocked over my Nurgle Chaos Lord twice, breaking his powerscythe on the second knock. Insincere apology followed, but while reaching to measure range, he snagged his shirt on his Sisters of battle tank, dragging it off the table onto the floor where all the metal bits went flying. My buddy Bruce at the next table laughed out loud and when the guy looked at him, he shrugs and says "karma's a pain in the butt, huh ?"

Arkaedin
04-09-2009, 05:20 AM
I love playing against painted armies, but I understand if you can't get it all done. I am very behind on painting my marines, but moving to and from college plus other things that life demands really cuts into the hobby time I have. It has more to do with the fact that I used to be terrible at Time Management, but I'm getting MUCH better at that.

Captain Castus
04-09-2009, 09:43 AM
Weird response from the staffer I reckon...

When I was in my local GW a few weeks ago I was chatting to one of the staff there and he asked why I didn't come in a play more... To which I replied "Partly, because I don't like playing with a semi-unpainted army and I'm rarely organised enough to get a full list finished (except my UMs... ;))

His reponse? A broad grin and "Good on you mate!"...

I admit I'm more attached to the aesthetics of the game than the actual game (I rather play a beautiful game on a beautiful table than win a competitive game!), but I reckon stores should be as encouraging as possible when it comes to playing with painted armies...

CC

DarthXander
04-09-2009, 10:25 AM
To me the hobby was always more about building and painting your army than it was gaming.

I've played a few games over the years but the time I put into the hobby was always far more about the force I was building and aiming for completeness. For example, I currently own an entire company of space marines, they aren't all painted but I really want to paint them and would never think about gaming with them unless they were!

I guess when you are a bit younger and the hobby is all about playing games and winning the actual modelling aspect kinda goes out of the window.

gendoikari87
04-09-2009, 01:18 PM
wow I'm really sorry to hear that man. if it helps, it's not that way everywhere. Down at my local game store I think i'm the only one who isn't 100% finished with painting and that's because I just got three new snipers. Most of our players are like in their 30's though, so they respect their own models enough to have them painted and respect other peoples models enough not to screw with them. But even the young ones have that kind of respect too.

Marticus
04-09-2009, 01:23 PM
seems an odd attitude froma blueshirt.... hmmm, ive only played in the store once, i tned to game with my firends, but the one time i did game their was only convinved to by a staff member who wanted to challenge my high elves with his druchii (he got a slapping though) but his army was only a quarter painted, my prob about a third at the time, nothing was siad and it didnt bother me, but i did think, wow staff not even painting their armies. as ye seen from my wip im working thoriugh slowly, but then family comes first so my painting time is limited, thus i have no worries playing with or against unpainted stuff, the diff being i WANT to finish it so it looks at least decent, its not nice having an unpainted character in my painted units.. but for now it does. and the time i was in there some kid picked up my tiranco chariot, which was painted, the old metal one and just dropped it. he just looked at it while it shattered, no sorry no nothing. :(

darknight
04-09-2009, 01:25 PM
tell ya some people are so rude, think i would have picked one of his minis up broke it and said ah well.

grimdisco
04-09-2009, 01:42 PM
I cant stand rude people, if that was me I would have packed up my stuff and told him off..
I also would have told off the store employee and complained to the mangier or owner about the rudeness of the employee... If it was the owner I would stop going to the store and find a group that plays elsewhere.

ChrisSpaceWolves
04-09-2009, 02:28 PM
The problem is that its a GW store. Its the store I'm the leader of the gaming club at on top of it. In that store they dont have a painted requirement. Heck at the Chicago Battle Bunker there is no requirement for paint. There were people who were walking into the store who stoped to watch the game because of my army which made me feel good, but the guy who should have been the most happy that one of his customers had a FULLY PAINTED AND BASED FORCE didn't give two craps.....

I know that I dont need any recognition but his response totally threw me all night. I couldn't get anything right from then on. Maybe I'll just play with my friday club from now on. They all have painted armies, and are all about them. I'm not a snob about only playing painted armies but it seems that a person who paints his stuff is more apt to be careful when moving around someone else's stuff.

thanks guys... I just kinda needed to vent a bit about this.


Chris

LAZtheinfamous
04-09-2009, 02:30 PM
thanks guys... I just kinda needed to vent a bit about this.



Astro- lancing the boil that is the bad game store experience!

Gideon_Not_Ravenor
04-09-2009, 02:43 PM
I still care about painting. I don't mind if the opponen't models are unpainted so long as they are attempting to get it painted. :)

Honsou
04-09-2009, 02:48 PM
In regard to painting, it is sad that so many people don't take the time to paint their models, but judging in terms of how well they are painted might be a little harsh. For one thing, there are always going to be kids and whatnot, as well as newcomers. And then there are people like me who just never got the hang of painting, and prefer to spend those hours converting instead.

Inquisitor023
04-09-2009, 05:33 PM
who just never got the hang of painting, and prefer to spend those hours converting instead.

Or me, who can't do anything about the hobby! :D

But, that is just idiotic. The gamer (While so rude) is understandable. Some people are just wee [CENSORED]

But the employee! That boils blood.

Skringly
04-09-2009, 05:34 PM
Maybe you should super glue a paint pot to his forehead...? :rolleyes:

Captain Kellen
04-09-2009, 05:51 PM
I care about painting. The fiirst thing I really took to heart, learned from a man in New York named Andy Roy, is that you don't play with unpainted minatures.

Either it's a game or it's a hobby.

Gamers just slap the models together and begin to play as fast as they can. I know this is huge generalization but holds true in many cases. Gamers are great coming off the starting line but fade with time. It's just a box with little toy soldiers in it.

If you into it for the hobby then you are looking at a different kind of person. For example, I know that many people here lean towards one aspect of the hobby or another, like Trygon. I see more of his sculpting and tutorials than I do of his fiction in the arena or other places. It does not mean he 'hates' fiction, just that he preferes something over the other. He's a hobbiest.

Another unique thing about people into the hobby is that some are not 'great' at playing, painting, and such. They keep at it because they enjoy the divergence from eveyday living. I suspect a more than a few people on Astro fall into this catagory but there is nothing wrong with that.

I think that the store 'worker' was there to make money at something they are good at and not something they love to do everyday. Oh, I am sure the people at that shop are nice enough, but obviously by your treatment it is some sort of "facade".

I know several GW employee's. The ones that are rsing in the ranks are the ones who love the hobby. If you ever run into a guy by the name of Mark Bolger, tell him that Tim from Richmond says 'hi'.

Keep painting and posting your pictures,

You and your work will be around a lot longer than many,

CK

gendoikari87
04-09-2009, 07:35 PM
Don't let people like that bother you. It seems apparent that some of the store owners don't take pride in their armies. I mean isn't that part of what the actual game is about? showing off your hard work?

Scoppio
04-09-2009, 10:24 PM
In this cases I would use my middle finger to scratch my forehead or to put may glasses back

Skringly
05-09-2009, 01:23 AM
In this cases I would use my middle finger to scratch my forehead or to put may glasses back

HAH! Thats low.




;)

shingouki
13-09-2009, 01:53 PM
i know how you feel you put all your effort into something and it gets almost misstreated.if it was my troops getting dropped about ,the only whoops would be the culprit running for his life.my local GW is a class place and the lads there wouldnt have any of that crap.i think its ok to field some minis unpainted but not a whole force.

Brother-Captain Nathaniel
14-09-2009, 01:18 AM
Well, I haven't played or even had a full army since 3rd edition, but, maybe because I'm an artist, I simply WON'T field an army unless it is painted and based.

christheabject
14-09-2009, 04:16 AM
Most of the CSMs I play with are unpainted, but I'm mostly playing with a group of friends and not at an establishment of any kind.
What bugs me, though, is that one of my friends refuses to paint his models. He's a perfectionist and since he doesn't think he can get them perfect himself, and doesn't trust anyone else to do it well enough for him, he just refuses to have them painted at all. :(

kharn the betrayer
14-09-2009, 08:12 AM
Hmmmmmm !

I do not like painting, I am not very good at it, but I make the effort and never play with unpainted models.....

So if lazy old me can do it so can everyone else, eventually.....

I have no problems with unpainted models, I have no problems with badly painted models. I do have a problem with slagging off peoples painting.

No one touches my models before asking, and I touch no ones stuff without asking. Thats called manners....

Dang there you go I will have to take my pills again....

Polity tell them next time that if they break any models you will snap off the same bits from them....Works for me.

Rules in my local is as long as you show more models painted they will let you away with undercoated models for a little while....

You care and I care and I am sure everyone here cares, we paint we game and we scheme to win. Next time take in some monoliths and destroyers lots of destroyers, see how he handles that.

Your painting is good they are probally just jealous...

Vent all you want we are here to listen and hand out candy, do you want a blue one?

Drakdylon
17-09-2009, 06:49 AM
Hmm.I care about painting, it's just that it's hard to find time to do it. I would say I have maybe a third of my army painted and the rest is unpainted. Of course, I'm generally playing with my friends who have armies with the same level of paint on them, so it's not a big deal.

However, the guy was very rude to knock your lord -your PAINTED lord- off the ridge and not say "OhmycrapI'msorry! Is he okay?" or at least "Oops! Sorry!"
Just "Oops..." doesn't cut it.

Dante
17-09-2009, 09:31 PM
i personally think that painting is importen ( i know i am not very good but ...) aspecially with SM, because you need paint to tell the difference between squads like honour guards and assault marines or tactical and dev squads..

Hialmar
18-09-2009, 12:10 AM
Either it's a game or it's a hobby.

I could not disagree with this statement more. Most of the folks that post on forums like this always paint, but a large portion of the people do both.

At the local store most of the 20+ year olds do not paint and other than the odd model or two, have no ambition to do so. All of the 30+ year olds paint and usually only game with painted pictures. I firmly believe it is a generational thing that also frequently carries over to the general rudeness factor.

LAZtheinfamous
18-09-2009, 12:25 AM
Ah, I disagree with the generational thing. Most people I know didn't play with fully painted at that age. Some of the still don't ten years later. But more paint as time at the game store becomes limited. I think part of it is a time spent thing. If you hang out at the gamestore every night, then there is more chance to play then to paint. Er. I mean to say that once older responsibilities come on, you have more time to paint, and less to hang out.

Kishvier
18-09-2009, 01:32 AM
I love playing against painted armies, but I understand if you can't get it all done. I am very behind on painting my marines, but moving to and from college plus other things that life demands really cuts into the hobby time I have. It has more to do with the fact that I used to be terrible at Time Management, but I'm getting MUCH better at that.

I agree with ark, my army isn't fully painted because I don't have the time and I paint models, EXTREMELY slowly, like 6 hours a marine.:o Getting an army larger than 1k is near impossible for me. I mean I like playing painted armies, but I know I myself can't get a painted army up to standard easily.

Honsou
18-09-2009, 05:22 PM
Sounds to me like you need to work on getting core groups done, and increase the size of your army slowly as your models are painted...

Tall
22-09-2009, 01:19 PM
On reading this I agree with most points of view, the staff member was a bit of a muppet for the way he so casually dismissed your painted models. You'd think with all the painted stuff on display and the very nature of the hobby that a painted army would be encouraged with open arms, more so with you having a game where the public would see what was going on.
As for your opponent, mild comments about dice and tape measures as well as models disappearing about his person would have been the first thing coming from me after a mumbled oops instead of his begging your forgiveness!! (But that's probably just me I tend to get a bit protective over models which I've spent many evenings working on, that and I think I've got anger management issues, but I digress) I've only really gotten stuck into painting in the last couple of years while I've been able to get away with it at work, but then again it's not very often I can get a game in. It's not that people don't care any more I just feel that the world tempts us with to many distractions and people can be easily led away from something which can get dreary and mundane, the trick is to keep it interesting. Anyway I'm starting to ramble on like my dad so I'll stop there.

ChrisSpaceWolves
22-09-2009, 03:19 PM
I hadn't commented about this yet but feel that it's worth mentioning, we played a HUGE planetstrike game Sat. and I was in charge of the defenders. It was a disaster. from a play standpoint the defenders stood around for an hour after they deployed waiting for the attackers to firestorm, deepstrike, and then move any additional forces in form the board edge. Every SW i put on the board was painted except for 1. During the game a guy asks if he can join in and the guy running it says sure.

I was told before the game that I had to remove my drop pods form my list as the defenders dont get any reinforcments in that manner. I obliged as it was a fluffy reason and sounded like a good one to boot scenario wise. This guy they let in late starts to put styrofoam cups on the table... I asked what he was doing and he said putting in his drop pods.

Now, I'm not an elitist jerk but I asked him what he was doing and he said he was putting down his drop pods. I then said, " Your army is eldar not marines how do you have drop pods?"
He said, " I'm proxying my army from my eldar forces because I just want to play marines today."

Now most of these models weren't fully assembled, there was zero paint on any of the army which isnt a big deal except for the proxies. He was told no to use his cups that it was uncool, and as he's moving his stuff him and his buddy lay a cardboard box on my jump troops, my Banner bearer, my land raider and my Wolf Lord with twin wolf claws..... I hit the roof.

He said,"They are just little men, what's the big deal?"
at which point I grabbed the manager, told him the situation and whispered to him to get the guy away from my miniatures or I was literally going to throw him off the mall balcony. It seems that there is a complete lack of respect for peoples things in the store I go to. Unfortunately, 90% of the employees are my good friends.

After the exchange we lost an attacking Ork player, he said he wasn't having any fun, we lost a defending Tyranid player... I have no idea why he was on our side, and we lost one of the little guys who was playing Necrons to phase out.

I don't understand the lack of respect for peoples stuff. Do i start keeping my painted models at home so I don't care anymore? Perhaps I just need to go to another store from now on so I don't have to deal with this type of person, although I know they are everywhere.

Chris

Tall
22-09-2009, 03:49 PM
You were remarkably restrained there I'm impressed. :cool: It's a disgrace really, just because their models aren't even assembled let alone painted doesn't mean they should treat yours in the same manner. It would appear the saying treat others as they unto you has lost all meaning these days!

Consadine
22-09-2009, 03:52 PM
Styrofoam cups? Lol.


He said,"They are just little men, what's the big deal?"
I'm pretty sure that all totals up close to $100, plus the paintjobs (time is money, and paint costs money :p) on them. Thus, very expensive little men.

Your store (is it a GW?) needs a set WYSIWYG policy. This can allow a few proxies, but not an entire unit/army. Sure, this is a "for fun" game (anything non-tournament, really), but there's a reason GW makes models for (almost) every unit in every army.

Go visit another store on their open gaming day and hope the environment is better. Paid off for me despite adding on another ten to fifteen minutes of driving.

Honsou
22-09-2009, 05:00 PM
Chris, although I personally have never had to boot anyone for their behaviour, I have seen things that do really show how little some people care- even if they were just little plastic men, and Consadine has already pointed out the flaw with that approach, they are still yours (your property, your effort, etc). That sort of behaviour on the part of others is unacceptable.

That said- sure, accidents happen, and not everyone is going to be as puritan about their approach to proxies and unpainted armies. As I stated earlier in this thread, I am generally quite adamant about using everything correctly, and everything painted. For me, that's the only way to truly stop proxies and the like. That said, some people are slightly laxer about that- being a large community there is going to be a wide spread of opinions; we shouldn't forget that while we rant away about the behaviour of a few. And it is still, fortunately, relatively few.

As Cons has mentioned a WYSISYG policy is something that might be worth bringing up, particularly if you've got the staff on your side- a few proxies or unpainted models is one thing, a whole army is a completely different thing. If you really want to bring some sense into it, you could also consider a gaming group- often GW has no problem with them setting up shop in the store itself, or you could put your meetings elsewhere. Key thing is that you can assert some amount of control, quality control so to speak. Now some people worry about issues surrounding gaming groups, but don't forget that it can be anything from a handful of players to an invite only exclusive club, all the way to financial subscription groups with large numbers.

The Xenocide
22-09-2009, 05:27 PM
Either it's a game or it's a hobby.

As Hialmar said, it isn't one or the other, but I think I know what you mean. People are treating Warhammer more like a game than a hobby these days. More people nowadays (especially the younger generations) just buy lots of models to get a better army and aren't into painting/converting as much. It's a shame that the hobby side is deteriorating, but that's just the way it goes. I suppose it's probably partly because there are more distractions at home - TVs, games consoles, etc. - so people spend less time on the modelling side of things.

I'm not in any way accusing Astro members of this, it's just what I believe is happening ;)

The X

Dante
22-09-2009, 09:51 PM
Cant read this thread without being angry.. i have 5 friends that i normally play with so dont have alot problems with people being disrespectfull about models... (have a problem with one of them not painting his army alot..)
i may start doing some tournements soon... should i bring a baseball bat as part of my army?

Honsou
22-09-2009, 11:22 PM
Cant read this thread without being angry.. i have 5 friends that i normally play with so dont have alot problems with people being disrespectfull about models... (have a problem with one of them not painting his army alot..)
i may start doing some tournements soon... should i bring a baseball bat as part of my army?
No. In my experience a firm set of rules is a better item to bring- have a strong and clear set of rules worked out, and make it clear to everyone that disqualifications occurs if they are breached. It works much, much better than the baseball bat approach: it's a varied community, if everyone knows the deal going in, that works better than stand-offs because of disagreements, or a few individuals.

LAZtheinfamous
22-09-2009, 11:59 PM
As Hialmar said, it isn't one or the other, but I think I know what you mean. People are treating Warhammer more like a game than a hobby these days. More people nowadays (especially the younger generations) just buy lots of models to get a better army and aren't into painting/converting as much. It's a shame that the hobby side is deteriorating, but that's just the way it goes. I suppose it's probably partly because there are more distractions at home - TVs, games consoles, etc. - so people spend less time on the modelling side of things.

I'm not in any way accusing Astro members of this, it's just what I believe is happening ;)

The X

Wiggin, I gotta disagree with you there. Ten years ago, when I was starting to get back into the hobby after a few years off, it was the same thing. Young guys with big armies and minimal paint (if any). There's still a bunch of that. There's still friends of mine who do the same thing. It's a style thing. What I mean is that there are those of us who focus on one side or the other. However, I've often seen it shift from one to another. And sometimes back again.

The setting of boxes down though, is unforgivable. Now, a devious little me, if I were the jealous type and envious of masterclass level models and was ashamed of his own work...er...MY work. I might just take a little disrespect out of spite. Just maybe that's what I would do. Little kid like, if my models look like excerement, everyone's models must look like excerement.

KaizerVonAwesome
30-09-2009, 05:38 AM
I would have smashed his cups and knocked his damn box on the floor. Whats the big deal? They're little men right? And you can't have drop pods but he can have Cup Pod eldar marines? What a load of crap. Get offa my table junior, big kids only.

Paint your models. They don't need to all be done but don't leave em unpainted that's just lazy. Show up on time or you're not playing. Respect another person's property (BOXES ON MY STUFF = HAVE FUN AT THE HOSPITAL). All simple rules I would think.

Screw being polite. Politeness is what made people like that think they could get away with stupidity. I know it isn't in character for someone into this stuff to be confrontational but sometimes you just have to bite the bullet and get in a guy's face.