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LAZtheinfamous
10-07-2009, 06:27 PM
Well, after the fairly good reaction to my battle report, I've decided to put together a couple of lists here. This is just the warband lists from the main book, if you were to go and buy the bits in plastic. The most expensive is Undead at $107.25. Each one of the warbands includes FAR more models then you can actually put into a warband! So mordheim is a great way to start a fantasy army.


Human Mercenaries;
Maximum 15 people.
Cost; $35 for Empire Militia 20 men(And you would have 5 left over!)
Total: $35 the absolute cheapest, with a total of 5 extra models!

Possessed:
Maximum 15 models
Magister, 2 Possessed (aka Spawn), 2 Mutants, 5 darksouls, 3 beastmen Gors, + bretheren.
Cost: $35 for Marauders of Chaos 16 men (with 1 left over), $29.75 for 2 Chaos Spawn, $35 for 12 Gorsin the Beastmen Regiment (9 extra!), Mutants can be made from Maruaders + Spawn Leftovers, Darksouls can be done with alternate paint scheme. Same with Magister.
Total: 99.75, with a total of 10 extra models (mostly beastmen!)

Witch Hunters;
Maximum of 12 models!
Witch Hunter Captain, Warrior Priest, Witch Hunters (3), Five Flagellents, Five Warhounds, Zealots.
$35 for Empire Militia (Over 8 left over!), 11.50 for Warrior Priest, $25 for 10 Flagellents (five left over!), $15 for 5 plastic wolves for Warhounds.
Total: $86.50, with a total of 13 extra models!

Sisters of Sigmar;
So sorry, no cheap way out here! Gotta go with the originals!

Undead;
Maximum of 15 models.
Vampire, Necromancer, 3 Dregs, Five Dire Wolves, Ghouls and Zombies
Cost: $15 for Vampire, 13.25 for Necromancer, $35 for 20 Zombies (more the 6 then you could ever use!), $22 for 10 Crypt Ghouls, $22 for 10 Dire Wolves (five left over), Er. Dregs, do varient color schemes on zombies, that's the easiest way!
Total: 107.25 with a total of 11 minimum left over models!

Skaven:
Maximum of 20 models
Assassin, Sorceror, 2 Black Skaven, 2 Night Runners, 1 Rat Ogre, Verminkin, Giant Rats.
$35 for 20 Night Runners, which can be modelled for everything in your Warband. $40 for 2 Rat Ogres/3 Giant Rats/Two keepers, $9 for Giant Rats.
Total: $84 with a minimum of 3 left over (at least), but you could do it with just the $35 Night Runners Box.

Now. The thing is with these, is that you could do more expensive (or in some cases cheaper) builds. Also some of the other Empire Frames may work better for certain things. Like Empire Archers for $24.75 for most of a Human Mercanaries Reikland Warband. Also if you and a few friends start building, you can do some swaps. For instance. One guy wants a Witchhunters, and you are doing Undead, swap some dire wolves to be used as warhounds and grab some humans off of him.

Aeth
10-07-2009, 08:58 PM
I really want to give Mordheim a go, keep thinking it would be a good excuse to buy some of the LotR models for converting :)

That being said the original models are available on the GW site for around 20-25 in packs of 8 models.

LAZtheinfamous
10-07-2009, 09:27 PM
Yes, they are but they are for the most part a horrible value. I'll use the US prices cause every time I shift it goes wonky on me. For instance the Undead Warband;

1- Vampire
1- Necromancer
2- Dregs
4 Metal Zombies
$40.

Now the seperate values;
1- Vampire $15
1- Necromancer $13.25
2- humans of a sort. I'll use Empire Militia. 1 tenth of a box, should be 3.50.
4- Zombies- 1 Fifth of a zombie regiment, $6.
Total; 37.75.

Now the problem with this set, and actually most of the set, is that is only a BEGINNING warband. A total of 8 models, but a typical warband in campaign mode gets to 15 models very quickily. So at the very least you'd have to buy another of the same warband for $40, which would give you useless models. You can only have one vampire, one necromancer, and three dregs. Which is the other problem.

You need all the hero choices you can get from the start, and in an Undead warband, that's 1 Vampire, 1 Necromancer, and 3 Dregs, which isn't what the Undead box comes with. It's better to go out and get the plastics. Yes, you'll have a ton of models extra, BUT you would have almost every possible build from the Sole Vampire with 14 zombies to the Vampire, Necromancer, 3 Dregs and 10 ghouls. Or Vampire, Necromancer, 3 Dregs, 5 dire wolves, and 5 ghouls. Or whatever. For a grand total of 107 bucks. And a nice cornerstone to starting a Vampire Counts army.

That's really why I posted these alternates for the warbands. Cause you CAN go and get them from GW, but you'll need more models very quickily! Also the other problem with them is that some of the models are only available when you buy the warband. Such as the Witchhunters War Hound, or the Chaos Possessed Models. You can have up to five warhounds. Spending $200 for 5 of them is stupid, when you can get 5 wolves for $15 from the mounts bits section of GW. Possessed are almost as bad, you have to have two Possessed, or you do not have your full compliment of heroes. So you can either go buy two of the possessed warbands for $80, or 1 box of Chaos spawn for like $25.

To be honest, I would love to see GW package these like this specially for Mordheim, but it won't happen.

Though just as a silly side note; The Skaven Warband on sale for 29.75 on GW's site is actually; half a box of the Night Runners Regiment which is $35.

Aeth
11-07-2009, 12:35 AM
One thought I did have was to get a box of Haradrim warriors and use them to create a warband with an Arabey feel. You get 24 models for 16.15 (12 with bows, 12 with sears) then I just need a character model or 3. Will leave a ton of extra wee men but I'm sure I could find some use for them down the line.

LAZtheinfamous
11-07-2009, 12:53 AM
Actually those would be nice. Make a good Marienburg (Human Mercanaries) warband. Or Possessed. Good choice for a home grown campaign. Fer instance, a buddy of mine (who shall remain nameless) used Reaper Dwarfs for his dwarf warband. Which is fine at the house.

Hephesto
11-07-2009, 01:00 AM
I'd love to see how those turn out, do keep in mind that LotR minis are just a little bit smaller than WHFB!

Faileas
11-07-2009, 12:20 PM
I got some of those scottish style warriors (think they are lambus or something) from LOTR to use as conversions (or raw) for part of my Warband (its going to be a human collection), you can't really tell the difference size wise.

I know where laz is coming from with the price (but they do look nice and would be fun to paint), I plan on picking up a couple of the individual model packs (they are no more expensive than your standard packs). The main problem with the other non MH packs would be without converting they would look the same as any other, which would be fine for the likes of warhounds or standard troopers etc, but I'd want most of my ' warband chars' to look different from another WFB unit.

Also A great list Laz its very helpful and has gave me plenty to think about.

LAZtheinfamous
11-07-2009, 12:31 PM
I love directing people to Mordheim, Faileas, I find it one of the most rewarding of the GW games.

Just as a side note for those interested in Human warbands, even if you are not planning on using the Empire Militia as the models themselves, they come with almost all the weapons that can be used in Mordheim. Swords, Axes, clubs, bows, crossbows, guns, two handed swords, halbreds, etc. So worth getting even if you don't plan using the men themselves. Great for customizing another warband.

Marticus
11-07-2009, 12:32 PM
damm right laz.. thats an invaluable box set for mordheim.. with all the wee bits in it

Faileas
11-07-2009, 02:38 PM
Cheers Laz, I had planned on getting one of those, and possibly the archer one too? One of my chars i want to make has a wide brimmed feathered hat and crossbow and the recent release seemed tailored just for that. (basing the warband on a group of friends roleplay char's)...torn now though to make a norsican one (instead of the WFB army)!!! dammmmmmmmmmmmm too many things I want to do *mutters*

Aeth
11-07-2009, 05:31 PM
I love the shot down bird in the new archers boxset.

fridge61
11-07-2009, 08:38 PM
Despite the fact that you may know me as a 40K player I do have quite a stash of WHFB minis.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m5/fridge61/DSCF2055.jpg

Reckon I can find something in there to mutilate and turn into a Mordheim warband? :D
I hasten to add I've never played WHFB and know absolutley nothing about it I've just managed to collect all that stuff from car boot sales and from Christmas presents etc.

Hephesto
11-07-2009, 08:46 PM
You're bound to find some great goodies in there! Looks like chaos, elves and empire in there.

LAZtheinfamous
11-07-2009, 11:46 PM
Could probably make about 5-6 warbands. Especially if your game group isn't too WYSIWYG. Which is hard for Mordheim. Cause then you have to buy new models, or convert them after almost every game. If I had as much money as I do sense, I would love to do a "Advancement" type of models. Especially for the heroes. Kinda like how they have three different Valtan's in the Empire Range. I would love to do early hero, middle hero, and epic hero.

Faileas
12-07-2009, 02:26 PM
Don't go putting ideas like that into my head Laz!!!!! *grins*

Wow Fridge, that's a impressive box of goodies , i'm liking the high elves.

Aeth
12-07-2009, 05:58 PM
Been having a wee bit of a rethink, I suddenly have an urge to go with skaven. Who wants to play as man-things anyway? ;) This is what I had in mind:

Night Runners: 17.60
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat1300327&prodId=prod1040365

Grey Seer & Rat Ogre: 14.70
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat1300326&prodId=prod1010023

Assasin: 7.85
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat1300326&prodId=prod1130292

Giant Rats: 5.85
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat1300327&prodId=prod1150010

Scenic bases: roughly 20 euro for 20 bases
http://www.shop.microartstudio.com/cobblestone-bases-20x20mm-p-212.html


Gives me a full warband on some smart looking bases for less then 70 with some models left over.

LAZtheinfamous
12-07-2009, 06:17 PM
Nice choices! The assassin is a great sculpt. Not especially necessary since you can build one out of the night runners box, but the metal model does have something nice to it! Thanquol and Boneripper are a good choice, since you won't have left over Rat Ogres, and you get the Seer as well. Good choices.

What's everyone else playing?

Faileas
12-07-2009, 06:24 PM
I haven't decided yet, between my custom human group, or the norsicans!..........*sighs*

Aeth
12-07-2009, 06:35 PM
I thought getting the extra assasin model would make him stand out more from the rest of the warband, especially as he will be the units leader. Does anyone know what you get in the night runners box? Are there enough bits to make the models really distinctive?

LAZtheinfamous
12-07-2009, 06:42 PM
Well, something else to remember, though, some Warbands excel in the beginning, and others don't really flourish until later in the campaign. For instance;

Skaven, are excellent in the beginning. Skip the Rat Ogre at first, just cheese out on cheap troops. The reason for this is the Rout Check. Er. Explanation. If you loose 25% of starting strength, you have to make a leadership test. If you fail it, you lose. By going in with a ton of giant rats, you have a much bigger force and can take more casualities before having to make that check. So if you have 16 guys and your opponent only has 8; Your opponent will have to kill 4 of your men, but you only have to kill 2 of his.

On the opposite side of the scale though, is Chaos Possessed. You will have a very small elite group in the beginning, and will probably lose most matches, just because of the rout check. My first game with them, I didn't get to go at all. Two of my cultists were taken out by shooting, and I failed my rout check. Fortunitly, they let me have a mulligan. Since I had gotten a babysitter and driven 1/2 hour to play. And setting up and dying is not playing. Don't expect your opponent to be so nice. However after you have a number of games under your belt your elite group becomes even more elite and very difficult to kill.

Human Mercanaries on the third hand (I told you I play Chaos!) are average in the beginning, and stay that way until the end.

Edit; The night runners box is filled with tons of goodies. It was made for Mordheim, and can be used to build the most generic force, or the most unique. Much like the Empire Militia Regiment, it has all the possible weapons you could think of. And the bits can be positioned in a lot of different ways. You can (and I have seen people do it) use the single Night Runners Box to build the entire warband (except for Rat Ogre and Giant Rats). Especially since some of the weird skaven weapons are on it, like the claw things and the ninja star things.

Aeth
12-07-2009, 09:40 PM
I didn't notice any bows/guns in the pictures, are they reliant on on stuff like sling shots and throwing stars/knives for ranged attacks? I'm guessing a ratling gun or warpfire thrower would be overpowered for mordheim.

fridge61
12-07-2009, 09:54 PM
I'm considering going for a human mercernary warband. I hope to attempt to make each person different but keep the same stats kind of thing... I just want to go for a bit of individuality and make each character personal if you know what I mean. Unless of course it's not 'legal' in the rules (I havn't gotten round to looking at them yet).

So anybody got any tips? :p

LAZtheinfamous
12-07-2009, 10:07 PM
@Aeth; Warplock pistols, blow guns, throwing stars, and slings are about the extent of it, I'm afraid.

@Fridge: Well, that's the awesome thing. Each model can stand alone. A hero model will have his own stats and improve them as an indivual, however henchmen are bought in groups and advance as a group. So if you buy three archers, every experience boost they get, they get as a unit. But each can be modelled differently, but still count as the same henchmen group as long as they have the same equipment. (there's far more depth to it then I am giving to it, but that's the basic).

And the neat thing is that with the right rolls the henchmen can advance to hero status and gain special skills and go up to the racial maximum for ability scores. However, you can only ever have 5 heroes! SO choose wisely.

Though as a side note, the smallest henchmen group you can buy is 1. So if you wanted to do each guy completly differently then his compatriots, then its ok too.

fridge61
12-07-2009, 10:21 PM
I am growing to like this game more and more LAZ.

Thank you for showing me the light :D

LAZtheinfamous
12-07-2009, 10:28 PM
Its a great game, and with just the main book, there's a lot to it. The supliments add some interesting side notes. Though I highley recommend "Best of Town Cryer", good luck finding it though.

Faileas
12-07-2009, 11:14 PM
Does anyone know where you can get the rules for the other warband? I found them once but forgot to bookmark the page? the GW site doesn't have them all (its missing amazons among others i think)

Aeth
12-07-2009, 11:19 PM
Pistols and blow guns sound cool, are they on the sprues or will I need to raid bitzbox?

LAZtheinfamous
12-07-2009, 11:21 PM
@Faileas; Amazons, Pit Fighters, and one other are broken beyond belief. I would suggest just sticking to the ones in the main book, the ones from the Best of Town Cryer (Dwarfs and Orcs), and the couple in the Empire in Flames (Beastmen, and Carnival of Chaos are the only two that spring to mind.)

@Aeth; The pistols aren't there. Blowguns can be spear bits with the head cut off. Or some other such. Not on the sprues. Though they are of limited usefulness.

Faileas
13-07-2009, 05:50 PM
would still quite like to look at them *grins*, I'm leaning towards doing both my warband ideas hehe.....Just need to decide if I want the norsicans to be based on the possessed or Middenheim bands *grins* Also hopefully should have a houserule to allow them to use throwing axes! *grins and winks at aeth*

LAZtheinfamous
13-07-2009, 06:11 PM
Yeah, there are some fun stuff with the 'banned' warbands. However, your opponents will not like playing against you.

Here is a site that is good for looking at stuff, but it's no astro. Mordheimer (http://www.mordheimer.com/index.htm). Good overviews, tactica, etc. No input from people like on Astro. Has some of the other weirder stuff on it.

Faileas
13-07-2009, 06:34 PM
I just wanted a look at them more than use the rules hehe, thankyou for the link Laz, I will take a peek later :D...Oh I have a question I've had a flick through the rule book and how you can get a human mage (warlock) they have the spells for them, but I cant see how you choose to make a person have the skill to cast?

LAZtheinfamous
13-07-2009, 06:53 PM
The easiest way is to get the hired sword Warlock. You can't get them when you first create your warband, but after your first exploration phase, you can. They cost X amount for initially getting them into the warband and then Y amount per battle afterwards as upkeep. As per forum rules, I edited out the costs, of course, I am also too lazy to look them up. They are extremely useful!

As a fun side note, if there are multiple people playing, chip in to get the Empire Wizards box. Then you can split it up. An Undead player could take two (one for necromancer, one for Warlock) and then get a few bucks from a friend and give them that 3rd model.

Faileas
13-07-2009, 07:28 PM
so you can't make your leader a warlock from the start?

Aye I had already discussed with Aeth about sharing a wizard pack, hopefully I will convince him to do the same with the hand gunners and statetroops or such

LAZtheinfamous
13-07-2009, 07:34 PM
Er. No. Looking closer at the FAQs you can have a warlock from the start, BUT he wouldn't technically be your leader. Possessed start with a Magister, who is a cult wizard leader. But only (using human mercanaries) the Mercanary Captain has the leadership skill, thus making him the leader leader. Though you could call your warlock the leader, but game rules wise, nope.

Faileas
13-07-2009, 08:13 PM
actually it suits me more if I can have someone other than my leader as my mage, I just wasn't sure how to pick magery as a skill choice!

LAZtheinfamous
13-07-2009, 09:36 PM
Well, it can be done. But it is very difficult for non-wizards to become wizards. First you have to get the ultrarare, ultraexpensive wizards tome. Then you have to get a skill slot on experience advance. Then if you have the academic skills list available you have to choose the Arcane Lore skill.